I read that demons don't enter a person and possess them. Rather they assimilate themselves to a person with like qualities and characteristics and then act conjointly with the person. So in other words, a homicidal entity, or demon, will attach itself to a wanna-be homicidal person. It will then act in conjunction with the person to further the person's ability to commit homicide....maybe resulting in homicide. I never heard of that before. Very interesting. Any thoughts?
I never really thought about that too much, but it doesn't sound too far fetched. Where did you read that Lillie?
I'm reading a book called "Poltergeist" by Colin Wilson. I like it so far. :)
Quote from: PPI Lillie on February 11, 2010, 01:26:53 AM
I'm reading a book called "Poltergeist" by Colin Wilson. I like it so far. :)
!!! I started reading the same book yesterday!!!!
:o
Very cool! I think you'll like it too. Lots of stuff to ponder. :)
True! And he's a compelling writer.
There are several pages dedicated to the Enfield case that Brian M. was talking about.
I blame High School for my dis-like of reading. It's not that I don't like to read, I just have it in the back of my mind that anything I read is going to suck. mostly. I know that is a TERRIBLE thought to have, because I have read.... well, a few books that were excellent, and I am currently trying to get friends from work to loan me, or at least recommend some books for me. Perhaps when you get finish Lillie, I could take a gander at your book?
My books are your books, my friend. :)
Jen can comment on this thread. I hope she does. She has done a lot of study on this subject and is very knowledgeable.
I hope they have this book available at the book store !
Im making my Monthly Thursday night trip.
You both have me curious - so I've added it to my list of books to buy tonight. :)
They have one copy of the book in the San Diego Public Library.
Tim, that's a great reminder... I always forget to check the public libraries. I automatically jump to going to the bookstore or buying from Amazon.com.
Also, as an FYI to everyone, there are some cool websites that facilitate the swapping of books through the mail. Check out paperbackswap.com, swaptree.com, and bookmooch.com.
Quote from: PPI Damian on February 11, 2010, 04:56:02 PM
Tim, that's a great reminder... I always forget to check the public libraries. I automatically jump to going to the bookstore or buying from Amazon.com.
Also, as an FYI to everyone, there are some cool websites that facilitate the swapping of books through the mail. Check out paperbackswap.com, swaptree.com, and bookmooch.com.
Hmm.. "bookmooch". I love it! I have to check it out...
Catchy name, right? :D
There are multiple theories on possession depending on what culture you're looking into. I have an entire bookcase full of info if anyone is interested.
The theory I've read about most is someone "opening a door." This could be playing w. a Ouija board, having an EVP session or simply reading a book about the subject. It's not always someone trying a spell or delving into "black magic." In some way you catch an entity's attention and then give "permission" for it to enter your life.
Most case studies I've read start out small. Minor nuisances or "cool tricks" that encourage the person to interact w. whatever is there. They may feel empathy toward it or even love if they believe it to be someone special who has passed. It progresses from there to more serious activity to the point where a person is so depressed, exhausted, terrified that they are barely hanging on. That is when possession can begin to take hold. There are different levels and stages of possession and the most effective cleansing and healing that I have researched seems to come from the Native Americans.
Demons are nothing to play with. I feel that true possession is rare but can be easliy misdiagnosed. I think people underestimate the demonic and it is a very rude awakening when someone discovers that holy water, sage, sweet grass, lavender, sea salt - may have very little effect depending on the hiearchy of the entity they are dealing with.
In speaking and working with others in the field (including John Zaffis and Tomy Durant - both absolutely amazing human beings) they are in fact finding that sage is just not as effective as it used to be.
I do have to add that I've had some terrifying experiences of my own this past year (thank heaven for Tomy and Zaffis) and it's actually caused me to back off of investigating for awhile for the safety of my daughter (who was physically getting hurt). I have not looked at this world the same way since.
I do believe that humans have free will and that counts for quite a bit. I also believe in spirit guides, guardian angels and the love and assistance of ancestors and loved ones passed.
Again, this is all just from my research, experience and opinion. If anyone is interested in further reading, I'd be happy to recommend some books (although a lot of mine are loaned out at the moment!) If you're interested in discussion, I am always up for that as well but I will not go into specifics about this past year. (I don't want to give any more attention to what I work every day to keep out) Giving an entity attention - any at all - is giving it recognition and therefore power. (again just a theory that I have found in my own life to be credible)
Quote from: TAPS Jen on February 12, 2010, 01:30:32 PM
Not to be all conspiratorial but I do have concern over the seeming surge of the demonic in the media and on tv. Lillith alone has appeared in at least 4 tv shows that really should have nothing to do with the paranormal at all as well as in art and music. Tie that in with the increase of cases coming in that involve young children and it makes me seriously wonder if it's not just coincidence.
Jen,
Please know that I am coming from a place of respect, with a sincere desire to help others.
I have problems with Lilith's portrayal as a demon in our 2000 years of Judeo-Christian history. (I am Nyingma, Tibetan Buddhist.)
I don't want anyone to be uncomfortable about my painting of her. I have been offered many $1000's of dollars for the painting. I will not sell it because I do not want the ideas in it to be misused. I may have it burned when I die, so it doesn't go in the wrong hands. It's because of the demons I have faced that I painted this painting. I spent years 10 researching the nature of demons before I painted it. (I can't speak for TV, nor music that have her as a theme.)
I have also battled demons, including physical attack. I agree with everything you have said. I am very sensitive regarding the pain and suffering of children (and animals) because of paranormal , or demonic experiences. I wouldn't want anyone to experience what I have. These entities are "sticky" and often vampiric.
I am interested in the material you have read & studied.
I am also curious if you have looked at the Nyingma view of demons & the demonic.
Quote from Jen:
"The theory I've read about most is someone "opening a door." This could be playing w. a Ouija board, having an EVP session or simply reading a book about the subject. It's not always someone trying a spell or delving into "black magic." In some way you catch an entity's attention and then give "permission" for it to enter your life."
Hey Jen, you touched on something that I had forgotten about, and I'd like to get your thoughts on it.
A few years ago I tracked down a copy of "The Exorcism of Anneliese Michel" which is the non-fictional account of a young female's possible posession by multiple demonic entities, and this story was the source for the movie "The Exorcism of Emily Rose". I excitedly began reading, and would read little bits at a time. I began to notice that I was feeling slightly physically ill whenever I would read the book, and it seemed to get worse the more of the book that I read. The ill feelings would fade hours later after I would put the book away.
I was about 1/3 of the way through the book when the realization finally hit me that I was feeling progressively worse whenever I read the book. It scared me enough to decide to put the book back in my bookshelf and not continue reading it. I still have the book, but I'm afraid to pick it up and continue reading it. I have never felt anything like this before reading this book or after deciding not to continue reading the book.
Any thoughts?
Quote from: PPI Damian on February 12, 2010, 03:55:02 PM
Quote from Jen:
"The theory I've read about most is someone "opening a door." This could be playing w. a Ouija board, having an EVP session or simply reading a book about the subject. It's not always someone trying a spell or delving into "black magic." In some way you catch an entity's attention and then give "permission" for it to enter your life."
Hey Jen, you touched on something that I had forgotten about, and I'd like to get your thoughts on it.
A few years ago I tracked down a copy of "The Exorcism of Anneliese Michel" which is the non-fictional account of a young female's possible posession by multiple demonic entities, and this story was the source for the movie "The Exorcism of Emily Rose". I excitedly began reading, and would read little bits at a time. I began to notice that I was feeling slightly physically ill whenever I would read the book, and it seemed to get worse the more of the book that I read. The ill feelings would fade hours later after I would put the book away.
I was about 1/3 of the way through the book when the realization finally hit me that I was feeling progressively worse whenever I read the book. It scared me enough to decide to put the book back in my bookshelf and not continue reading it. I still have the book, but I'm afraid to pick it up and continue reading it. I have never felt anything like this before reading this book or after deciding not to continue reading the book.
Any thoughts?
I also have had that happen, to the point where I won't approach reading about certain topics unless I am in "good" mental space.
Does that happen with others?
I don't mess with two things: Texas and Demons. One in the same? JOKE!
Seriously....demons are not something i feel comfortable dealing with. If there is even a remote chance of anything having to do with that at an investigation, count me out. I know it is extremely rare and most of the time when a client states they have demonic activity, it isn't that at all....however, better safe than sorry, in my book.
Quote from: TAPS Tracy on February 12, 2010, 06:13:19 PM
I don't mess with two things: Texas and Demons. One in the same? JOKE!
LOL! I have sat through 3 twelve-day Chod (Tibetan exorcism) ceremonies in 4 years. We couldn't do a thing for Texas!
Quote from: TAPS Jen on February 12, 2010, 06:24:19 PM
The book thing has happened to me - especially when research came close to what I was dealing with. While trying to take a book off my shelf about specific demons and angels there was audible growling and a crushing weight on my chest that made it phsyically hard to breathe. I now use a personal protection ritual before reading, investigating, helping, etc.
Debra - I think you are a brilliant artist! "Vampiric" is exactly the type of thing we were dealing with. Lillith was the name that kept popping up EVERYWHERE. (books, tv, conversation w. random people who have nothing to do w. the paranormal) I meant no offense and certainly no criticism of your work.
As I said, my experiences were my own and I would never (I hope) judge someone on their beliefs and experiences. I am sorry to say that I am not very familiar w. Nyingma but would love to learn more! Actually, I was hoping you and I could one day meet. I think I could learn a lot from you!
Jen,
I want to meet you too!
I just wanted everyone to understand why I would paint such a heavy topic!!
What we are seeing in our owns lives, and in the world around us is a very real problem that I don't take lightly.
There's allot I have to learn...
I am a bit socially awkward because I have never found people that I could discuss all these things with. I am SOOOOO blessed to be here!
I am sorry you have to have such experiences.
I'm sorry you've had to deal with what you've gone through as well. I have to believe that it's all for a (good) reason though.
Jen....I would love to hear more! Any book recommendations would be great. I'm a bigtime bookworm. :)
Damian.....I have found that, the longer a story goes on (i.e. three, four, or five books long), I get nauseated as soon as I start reading it. I have never been able to explain why. This happens to me no matter what kinds of books or stories I'm reading.
Hey Jen, thank you so much for sharing your knowledge on this topic. I too would love to hear more. Lillie pointed something out in another thread, but figured I would ask here also in case it got missed. You mentioned above that "opening a door" could be caused by using a Ouija Board, having an EVP session, or just reading a book. I'd really like to know more about that because, my stupid curiosity really has me thinking about Ouija Boards. DON'T WORRY EVERYONE, I'M NOT!!! However, are there any major differences with using an OB or having an EVP session? That sort of makes sense, but there clearly has to be something that makes people more comfortable having an EVP sesh. Any insight on this?
Just my opinion here - I feel that both invite something to communicate with you and therefore are not much different from each other.
I think a OB has a negative stigma attached (for good reason) and has gained a reputation as being a negative communication device. In comparison, digital recorders are new on the scene and we really don't know what consequences can come with evp sessions (well, I have my suspicions but it's too soon for the stories and experiences of others to catch up to the rest of society). Also, with myriad paranormal investigation shows currently in the mainstream, evp sessions have taken on an air of scientific credibility. People become familiar w. persons on a show - feel as if they know them. It's not a far leap from there to want to imitate them and since the people on tv do it and are ok, then along comes that sense of security. I already hear about slumber parties where they are now gathered around a recording device asking the same questions thrill seeking kids posed to a board just a decade ago.
Evp slumber parties? Doesn't suprise me I guess. Could be worse......at least they aren't drinking. Hopefully.
I guess it's a less-morbid way of doing the Bloody Mary dare. It's kind of taboo, and there's an element of fear and excitement, sounds like an activity that would be attractive to teens.
I'd do it. Oh. Wait. I did. ::| lol
Quote from: PPI Lillie on February 16, 2010, 09:02:23 PM
I'd do it. Oh. Wait. I did. ::| lol
"light as a feather......stiff as a board....."
Oh, sorry. Wrong slumber party. I was still in the 1975 version.
Quote from: PPI Damian on February 12, 2010, 03:55:02 PM
A few years ago I tracked down a copy of "The Exorcism of Anneliese Michel" which is the non-fictional account of a young female's possible posession by multiple demonic entities, and this story was the source for the movie "The Exorcism of Emily Rose". I excitedly began reading, and would read little bits at a time. I began to notice that I was feeling slightly physically ill whenever I would read the book, and it seemed to get worse the more of the book that I read. The ill feelings would fade hours later after I would put the book away.
I was about 1/3 of the way through the book when the realization finally hit me that I was feeling progressively worse whenever I read the book. It scared me enough to decide to put the book back in my bookshelf and not continue reading it. I still have the book, but I'm afraid to pick it up and continue reading it. I have never felt anything like this before reading this book or after deciding not to continue reading the book.
Any thoughts?
Hi there. I'm so glad you shared this. This has happened to me as well. And here I thought I was being paranoid or it was my imagination.
My last incident when studying up on exorcisms , I got really ill. I was reading up on the history of how it began, watching clips and so on. During that half hour I started feeling funny. I became dizzy, body felt weak, and I got sick to my stomach. After I got sick , i called it quits.
Thats happend a few time , just never to the point of getting sick like that. I always thought it was odd and all in my head. I dunno.
Nice to hear im not a lone in this weird experience. :P
Same here Shelly. Funny how someone else having a similar experience (paranormal or not) validates your own experience. That's why I always try to share openly...you never know who might benefit from it. :)
Hey Shelly and Damian.....try watching all four seasons of Desperate Housewives in a one week period. You'll be puking your guts out each time you see it or hear the theme song. I came very very close! It's like your body gets overloaded on one thing and reacts. Too weird!
Quote from: PPI Lillie on February 17, 2010, 10:26:38 PM
Hey Shelly and Damian.....try watching all four seasons of Desperate Housewives in a one week period. You'll be puking your guts out each time you see it or hear the theme song. I came very very close! It's like your body gets overloaded on one thinbg and reacts. Too weird!
LOL! Try the mute button!
Quote from: Debra, PPI Consultant on February 17, 2010, 10:33:17 PM
Quote from: PPI Lillie on February 17, 2010, 10:26:38 PM
Hey Shelly and Damian.....try watching all four seasons of Desperate Housewives in a one week period. You'll be puking your guts out each time you see it or hear the theme song. I came very very close! It's like your body gets overloaded on one thinbg and reacts. Too weird!
LOL! Try the mute button!
Lol Hmmmmm.....didn't think of it. lol lol
Quote from: TAPS Jen on February 12, 2010, 01:30:32 PM
If anyone is interested in further reading, I'd be happy to recommend some books
Hey Jen. What books would you recommend to get started in this field of study? Looking more at the analytical / scholarly perspective. This field of study has always been a huge draw for me. I find it fascinating. I do understand the dangers of walking down the path... but it never hurts to be informed. ;D
Demonology is not a science by default, it is a Religious belief. The Holy Bible does not support the belief in ghosts, only demons. Catholics take this a bit further as each Diocese must have one Priest able to perform exorcisms. Are Demons real? Are evil people real? Demons are fallen Angels that have choose to follow Satan. Demons want man kind to turn away from God, and seek earthly pleasures. The real question should be is man wicked because of Demons tempting him, or because mans wickedness is inherit, every person can answer that as they see fit.
Quote from: adminsandiegohaunted on December 08, 2011, 07:51:51 PM
Demonology is not a science by default, it is a Religious belief. The Holy Bible does not support the belief in ghosts, only demons. Catholics take this a bit further as each Diocese must have one Priest able to perform exorcisms. Are Demons real? Are evil people real? Demons are fallen Angels that have choose to follow Satan. Demons want man kind to turn away from God, and seek earthly pleasures. The real question should be is man wicked because of Demons tempting him, or because mans wickedness is inherit, every person can answer that as they see fit.
There are many other belief systems regarding demons.
The word "demon" comes from the Greek word "daimon", which was a guiding spirit or muse, or the source of genius.
In medieval times, mental illness was regarded as demonic possession.
In Tibetan Buddhism, demons are generated from the mind stream. This means, basically, that demons are thought forms generated by a highly creative mind. Sometimes they can appear to have a life of their own. The so-called "Tibetan Book of the Dead", is an instruction manual for dissolving these thought forms. Also, in Tibetan Buddhism there is a belief in "basic goodness" as opposed to "original sin".
As the times change, the concept of demons changes as well.
Fascinating topic. Thanks for bringing it up again!